Thoughts on anglecynn formations

For discussion of Anglecynn hosts and their strategies and tactics
That Guy
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Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby That Guy » Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:06 pm

I wanted to put up some tactical maneuvers I've had some success with and at least one I havent tried yet but think can be made to work. I'll be interested to hear what kind of feedback you guys have.
Also, I'm still in the learning proccess of the rules so please point out any critical errors.
First off, I want to say, spears are amazing, shields are handy, spears and shields together are the bees knees. As an Anglecynn player I think it would be folly to not utilize the reach and defensive posturing we have access to.Secondly, it should be painfully apparent that these sloppy bitmap images arent to any kind of scale, just a vague representation of what I'm trying to say.

This first pic is my default formation with duguth and gesith. I normally have at least 11 dudes in those units as a result of 10x duguth/gesith +1 thegn/forthegn. The idea here is to gap the front row and stagger the back row in those gaps so that you have a wider "wall" where the back row can utilize the reach of their spears through those gaps. And by being in base contact, they can make use of the "shieldwall" rules.
I've had a lot of success, setting up like this because in a worst case scenario you end up in a straight fight with everyone poking at each other as they would normally but in the best cases I've seen some odd occurances where the opponent cant quite reach the combat to contribute yet is still getting poked from the whole unit of spears.
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Next is one that when I mapped it out in an image, it doesnt look like much of anything useful but I promise I've had success with it. I've used this when I knew my duguth/gesith are gonna eat a charge from some monsterous infantry.
Obviously the small blue circles are the duguth/gesith, the larger red ones are the monsterous baddies. The "F" is marking out where I place my Forthegn/Thegn and the little black lines represent facing.The green blob is terrain of some sort that I'll talk about in a minute.
The facing of the duguth/gesith isnt overly crucial, just be sure their pointing mostly forward and have enough facing to poke into the center of the "V". The important thing here is to use that staggered formation I showed in my first picture, where the guys behind can poke through the gaps with their spears while utilizing sheildwall rules and that the front "row" of guys form that orange "V" to accept the charge.
What I've seen happen is that when the monsterous infantry try to cram in there, they get into strange and unfavorable positions in attempt to reach someone to punch because of the way "direct engagements work.
Check out the picture, we'll talk more afterwards.
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Now that green blob on the right can be crucial to really making the monsterous infantry get into bad positions and swallowed up by this "V" thing. (Shall we call it "The Wulfs Vaj Maneuver"?).
Consider this hard learned lesson: Anglecynn can be squishy, we can hit hard when we stack things in our favor but we cant sustain a hard fight for very long it seems. So baiting the opponent into bad situations is key here and always. Imagine that green blob is some kind of terrain that is gonna cause some sort of difficult movement modifier, slow them down and potentially ruin their day by mucking up a charge that they really want to get off with their big scary beat stick monsters. So position your "Wulfs Vaj" at such a distance that the opponent is confident he'll make it there but far enough away that it will be difficult to optimize his facing marks for the charge and end up tripping over himself along the way. Ideally you want to have your unit of spear toting hard cases peaking out around the terrain he's worried about to get himself to start the "tripping over himself" proccess. Its important to pick your terrain carefully because not all monster things are created equal and some get so big they, dont care what kind of terrain is there because it wont slow them down at all.


this is getting lengthy, I'll post the next one as a separate entity
Rob Boyce
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby Rob Boyce » Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:45 pm

This is very interesting keep it up! I'm a big fan of spear infantry, I think the reach can often be better than getting 1d10 damage
Stu
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby Stu » Fri Apr 22, 2016 10:11 pm

Seconded that this is really interesting. I've not really started playing yet, but my intention has always been to play my Anglecynn as big shieldwalls of human infantry. I've been a bit disheartened recently that all the summaries I've seen of the different kindreds' playstyles have the Anglecynn down as glass cannons, so it's good to know that playing defensively is viable if you're clever about it.
James Harding
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby James Harding » Fri Apr 22, 2016 10:19 pm

Definitely keep this up!
Starting an Anglecynn muster as I love the infantry. Have you tried spears in units bigger than 10? Wondering if you can get even more atacks in. Unlike Rob, I'm not as convinced that the extra attacks is better than the +d10!
That Guy
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby That Guy » Fri Apr 22, 2016 11:36 pm

Thanks for the feedback guys. Glad to hear I may not be as crazy as I sound.

@James Harding-I've not played spears in units larger than 10. But those days of experimentation are right around the corner. Currently I'm liking the idea of multiple spear units that can shuffle around each other and optimize poking angles.
+d10 can be a game changer for sure (I have a small Krokod force that gets to play that card) but under the right circumstances doing less damage to your opponent in such a way that they cant reach you to retaliate is pure perfection.I've been a fan of spears, long before I knew table top gaming was a thing and they are perfectly represented in Darklands as a tactically viable choice.....Also, Duguth cant buy a big hacky sword for +d10 damage, so may as well take the reach advantage.
@ Stu- Anglecynn do seem to have a bit of a glass jaw, but as long as you dont rely on the "cannon" part of "glass cannon" you can think your way around their deficiency. Bait your enemy out, make them over extend themselves, and then pull the trigger when they've pushed a little too far.

I have to apologize, I've been thinking about a formation thing using the binding and foresting of werwiulfs and Magenwulfs and Guthwulfs and I had a rather lengthy write-up done but I double checked all my numbers and found the unit I was using was outside of the command authority I was using. I'll keep thinking on it and post my theories when its all legal as per command structures.
The short version of it is. Foresters are awesome. Ambushing is scary. Guthwulfs will tear your opponent a new butt-hole.

I'm also racking my brain over flyers and "soaring". I know I'll be facing some at Buckeye Battles when I play against Dan Pratts Brythoniaid. Thats a puzzle I currently fear. If I think of anything I'll be sure to put it here but if you guys can think of a reliable way to fend of dive bombing death from above, please dont hesitate to speak up.
James Harding
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby James Harding » Sat Apr 23, 2016 7:12 am

Look at the reaction rules when it comes to dealing with fliers. All their engagements are indirect, so (from memory) non wild stuff can perform a withdraw reaction.
That Guy
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby That Guy » Sat Apr 23, 2016 12:39 pm

James Harding wrote:Look at the reaction rules when it comes to dealing with fliers. All their engagements are indirect, so (from memory) non wild stuff can perform a withdraw reaction.

A good place to start the thought process. Much thanks. Sounds like one more good reason to keep flankers and foresters off the table when we deploy.
Keeping wild and feral units hidden to come into the fray later in the game only leaves our more reliable and flexible guys as the only targets to outmaneuver these scary situations until our hammers and darts can emerge and destroy.... I like it.
Let the research begin.
That Guy
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby That Guy » Tue Apr 26, 2016 8:05 pm

I'm gonna preface this one like I do everything else: I'm not on solid footing with a lot of these rules so please please please scrutinize this one 6 ways from Sunday for any rules violations. Key things to look at here are gonna be "binding" rules and the order in wich individuals within a unit have to move.If I've messed up its likely going to be in those areas.
This is the formation I mentioned earlier that I havent tried yet and I had to go back to the drawing board after looking at the numbers.
The unit I'm working with here is 5xWerwulfs with a Werwulf thegn bound to 2x Guthwulfs. The critical parts of this configuration are
A.) The werwulf thegn, his presence should make your "ambush" action more reliable.
B.) The Guthwulfs on either end of the unit
C.) That the models closest to the Guthwulfs are standing back a little bit
( This formation should work with larger units, even wider ones so long as you maintain those gaps on the sides for your Guthwulfs)
Now the plan here is that the mixed unit of wulfy things can use their "forester" ability to pop out of the woods at the perfect moment and ambush a unit with a larger footprint. (2 Guthwulfs in a unit should make short work of anything with a smaller footprint without any tactical consideration).
So,in theory, what you want to do is line up your shot carefully and not pounce to early. The goal is to arrive on the narrowest end of your intended target and hit them hard from the side.
The formation is meant to give the Guthwulfs enough shoulder room that when they make their direct engagement move they dont start tripping over the smaller guys next to them and end up not being in the fight because some smaller grunt got in the way.
Hopefully, by stringing the Guthwulfs on the end of the unit, they can make use of their higher movement to help the unit wrap around the enemy like a bolo, wich should limit the opponents options to wiggle around for a better fighting position in successive rounds of combat.
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(The green blob is gonna be whatever forest you've chosen to emerge from and immediately ambush)

Once you've emerged and passed your "ambush" check (thankyou werwulf thegn) you turn your head marks and make the charge.
I've numbered the models in order that they should be moved to make the most room for your Guthwulfs larger bases to get to where they need to be ( positioning and circumstances will likely alter this as the game plays out). The two werwulfs that are staggered back to make room for the Guthwulfs and likely the guy in the middle of the formation wont make it into base contact for combat on the charge, they''ll get hung up behind one of their buddies, but thats okay because their job was to make that crucial room for the guthwulfs to get around the rest of the unit. *Its at this point that Im not sure if I've violated the order in wich models have to be moved to maintain "join" distance.*
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Dan Pratt
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby Dan Pratt » Thu Apr 28, 2016 12:40 am

Ambush, if you pass your skill test, leads to a direct engagement (6.15.3.1.2). Bear in mind that you must fill up the enemy arc in which the majority of each engager's base lies (6.10.6.1). In diagram, 1-3 would go into sight arcs, 4 & 5 can hit blind arc of front rank, 6-8 have the blind arc.

Just make sure no one sees you (6.54.4.1)

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Brightblade
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby Brightblade » Thu May 03, 2018 4:22 am

I've found that when playing my Anglecynn army with Flankers and Scouts that my opponent brings his armies to the centre of the table and keeps well clear of any tree areas thus negating my advantage of making an Emerge and Ambush action..

Is my opponent playing fair by doing that?

I say that he should play as if he us unaware of the Flankers and Scouts, but he argues that knowing that there are these units in the game he knows to keep away from the edges and trees...
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Rob Lane
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby Rob Lane » Fri May 04, 2018 1:10 pm

Brightblade wrote:I've found that when playing my Anglecynn army with Flankers and Scouts that my opponent brings his armies to the centre of the table and keeps well clear of any tree areas thus negating my advantage of making an Emerge and Ambush action..

Is my opponent playing fair by doing that?

I say that he should play as if he us unaware of the Flankers and Scouts, but he argues that knowing that there are these units in the game he knows to keep away from the edges and trees...


Well, there's not a lot to do about that except - don't tell him what you're bringing. If he's a cautious man he'll always keep away from woods and trees when he's facing Anglecynn though! So yes, he's playing fair.

I am a bit sceptical about how he's doing that, if you're following the terrain generation rules. How are you deciding on terrain?

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Rob
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Brightblade
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby Brightblade » Sat May 05, 2018 2:06 pm

We are still in the learning stage of the Game, and have just started using Orders and some Journeyman rules migrated up from Quick Play rules, we haven't started using Terrain or Host Positioning Rules yet, would these negate his ability to avoid forested areas?
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Jonathon Chester
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby Jonathon Chester » Sat May 05, 2018 7:30 pm

Brightblade wrote:We are still in the learning stage of the Game, and have just started using Orders and some Journeyman rules migrated up from Quick Play rules, we haven't started using Terrain or Host Positioning Rules yet, would these negate his ability to avoid forested areas?


Your kindred terrain would as you could put a forest in the middle of the board
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Rob Lane
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Re: Thoughts on anglecynn formations

Postby Rob Lane » Sun May 06, 2018 12:48 pm

Brightblade wrote:We are still in the learning stage of the Game, and have just started using Orders and some Journeyman rules migrated up from Quick Play rules, we haven't started using Terrain or Host Positioning Rules yet, would these negate his ability to avoid forested areas?


Yes, because you get to bring one area of forest / wood to place anywhere in your side of the board, which he can't move around.

It's a very simple process - the table is divided into 2' squares which you take turns placing terrain in (generated by a D100 roll). Your opponent can move yours around in your squares, and vice versa. Then you both get to place kindred terrain.

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Rob

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