Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

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Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Thu May 03, 2018 11:43 am

Everyone,

Please note that all of the kindred musters (and the muster rules) have been updated to fix a few errors here and there.

Go here to download them: http://mierce-miniatures.com/index.php?act=drm

Feel free to note any errors or typos in these updates by replying to this post.

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Icchan » Thu May 03, 2018 6:31 pm

I noticed most Norse units no longer uses the outdated Switch rule in their weapons, but they still exist in Filungi and Holumann.

EDIT: Nevermind, I see now why you would need those. Though the Holumann's options still make me question them. Sword is switch (Axe), Axe is switch (Shield). So if I use the sword I can still use the shield as well, but what if I use the axe, can I still use the sword? Shouldn't the Axe be switch (Sword)?

EDIT2: Also Hirdmen and Bondmen seem to be missing, is this on purpose?
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Fri May 04, 2018 9:13 am

Icchan wrote:I noticed most Norse units no longer uses the outdated Switch rule in their weapons, but they still exist in Filungi and Holumann.

EDIT: Nevermind, I see now why you would need those. Though the Holumann's options still make me question them. Sword is switch (Axe), Axe is switch (Shield). So if I use the sword I can still use the shield as well, but what if I use the axe, can I still use the sword? Shouldn't the Axe be switch (Sword)?


Yes it should! Good spot. The Axe / Sword should both switch with each other, leaving the other hand for the shield.

Icchan wrote:EDIT2: Also Hirdmen and Bondmen seem to be missing, is this on purpose?


Yes, they're not for public consumption - they shouldn't have been on the last muster. They're still in playtest, basically!

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Dunni the Stout » Fri May 25, 2018 12:15 am

Jute Muster v1.16,
With Thain has Influence (Wihtsweord) but Wihtsweord units are already Common ubiquity. Is there something else going on that I'm missing?
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Fri May 25, 2018 9:39 am

Yes, that means he can take two of them to be the command Mainstay unit. See 1·1·4·2·3 - COMMON on p6 of the Muster Rules.

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Dunni the Stout » Fri May 25, 2018 6:17 pm

Rob Lane wrote:Yes, that means he can take two of them to be the command Mainstay unit. See 1·1·4·2·3 - COMMON on p6 of the Muster Rules.

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And suddenly every question I'd been having about the major change in ubiquity and muster lists just clicked into place! I feel a little foolish that it's taken this long for me to get that. Life is good! Thanks Rob
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Sat May 26, 2018 5:43 pm

You're welcome dude ;o)

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Jonathon Chester » Tue May 29, 2018 7:57 am

Hi Rob,

The Taunagh have the shieldwall ability but no shields
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Tue May 29, 2018 10:14 am

Good point, I'll amend!

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby demyse » Tue May 29, 2018 3:45 pm

Death-Brute can compel/Influence the following on this profile - Compel (Drune-Brute, Brute, Brute Corruptor); Influence (Brute-Beast)

but the leader of brutes states the following - If a Death-Brute is mustered as a commander, only Drune-Brutes, Brutes, Brute-Beasts or Hulks may be taken in his command. One Death-Drune unit, one Brute unit, one Brute-Beast unit
or one Hulk may count their AUTHORITY as 0 if they are mustered within a Death-Brute's command

So the question is regarding Brute Corruptors, can they be taken or not, compel/influence says yes, leader of brutes says no

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Tue May 29, 2018 3:57 pm

Yes, that's a mishtook. Brute Corruptors are fine. I'll amend!

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby demyse » Tue May 29, 2018 4:23 pm

Rob Lane wrote:Yes, that's a mishtook. Brute Corruptors are fine. I'll amend!

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Does that also mean they can be included as one unit that has its authority reduced to zero?
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Icchan » Tue May 29, 2018 7:50 pm

Atalantes Khalkotes Sunfist equipment has " Switch (Oplon) ", however they do not have any equipment with that name.
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Brightblade » Tue May 29, 2018 10:26 pm

On the Fomoraic Spells of Ice list it has Ice Shards stated as a Focus spell, but then goes on to list a ranges for the spell, surely this should be a Sighted Spell rather than a Focus spell..
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Jonathon Chester » Wed May 30, 2018 9:01 am

Just a quick one Rob, the Beast of Danu has influence Fen Beasts but doesn't have the authority to take two units of Fen Beasts. As it stands the Beast of Danu has Authority 46 where as two units of Fen Beasts are 52. I am aware there was a general down grading of authority for the majority of spell casters, however was this one an accidental oversight or is this as intended?

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Wed May 30, 2018 9:19 am

Icchan wrote:Atalantes Khalkotes Sunfist equipment has " Switch (Oplon) ", however they do not have any equipment with that name.


Ah yes, that should be Aspis. Good spot!

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Wed May 30, 2018 9:20 am

Brightblade wrote:On the Fomoraic Spells of Ice list it has Ice Shards stated as a Focus spell, but then goes on to list a ranges for the spell, surely this should be a Sighted Spell rather than a Focus spell..


Whoops yes, that's a Sight invocation! Good spot, I'll fix.

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Icchan » Wed May 30, 2018 8:00 pm

Are there any changes planned for Stratekolossos now that the new Mesokolossos infantry starter has been released? Stratekolossos doesn't have enough authority to take command of both the mesokolossos and the bull of bronze.
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Wed May 30, 2018 8:36 pm

Yeah, I'll change that.

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Jonathon Chester » Thu May 31, 2018 4:53 am

Just a quick one Rob, the Beast of Danu has influence Fen Beasts but doesn't have the authority to take two units of Fen Beasts. As it stands the Beast of Danu has Authority 46 where as two units of Fen Beasts are 52. I am aware there was a general down grading of authority for the majority of spell casters, however was this one an accidental oversight or is this as intended?

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Thu May 31, 2018 8:54 am

Well that's weird, I answered that the other day. How odd. Simply put, the Beast of Danu shouldn't be able to Influence anything - I will remove that.

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Jonathon Chester » Thu May 31, 2018 9:06 am

Rob Lane wrote:Well that's weird, I answered that the other day. How odd. Simply put, the Beast of Danu shouldn't be able to Influence anything - I will remove that.

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Maybe you typed it but it didn't post? Thanks for the clarification
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Thu May 31, 2018 9:38 am

Icchan wrote:Are there any changes planned for Stratekolossos now that the new Mesokolossos infantry starter has been released? Stratekolossos doesn't have enough authority to take command of both the mesokolossos and the bull of bronze.


The Stratekolossos now has this rule:

Controller of Automata: If a Stratekolossos is mustered as a commander, a Compelled unit of Mesokolossos in his command has an AUTHORITY of 0.

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Icchan » Thu May 31, 2018 8:37 pm

So basically if Tekhnomantis uses his ring to force an activation on them, they'll automatically fail the force test? So better not force compelled mesokolossi...
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Jonathon Chester » Thu May 31, 2018 8:44 pm

Icchan wrote:So basically if Tekhnomantis uses his ring to force an activation on them, they'll automatically fail the force test? So better not force compelled mesokolossi...


I’d hazard a guess they only are 0 authority for muster purposes you’d still make the roll against normal authority. Also a 0 isn’t a auto fail, you can roll a 0 on a D100 roll ;) only auto fail for tests is 99
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Dunni the Stout » Fri Jun 01, 2018 5:22 am

Tarvax Tain has the realm Baalor, but regular Tavax have realm Cursed Herd. How does this affect unit selection and authority?
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Fri Jun 01, 2018 8:58 am

Well, it's wrong... he should be Cursed Herd of course! I'll change it. Good spot!

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby demyse » Tue Jun 05, 2018 1:11 pm

Infernii - Servile Fiend of Dis - there isn't a combat weapon entry for the 1 handed axe of Dis for the shieldwall variant
Byzantii - Signifier - cant form a command (I know they can go in the Host command, is this their only intention?)
Byzantii - demimagus - cant form a command (also assuming this is to stop wizard spam)
Byzantii - Auxilia Bestiarius - Parma doesn't have a switch option, currently the profile is a whip in one hand, with the option of a sword or dagger in the other, but no indication what hand can use the parma
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Wed Jun 06, 2018 9:57 am

demyse wrote:Infernii - Servile Fiend of Dis - there isn't a combat weapon entry for the 1 handed axe of Dis for the shieldwall variant


Good point! I'll sort that out...!

demyse wrote:Byzantii - Signifier - cant form a command (I know they can go in the Host command, is this their only intention?)


Yes. They are Signifers, not leaders...

demyse wrote:Byzantii - demimagus - cant form a command (also assuming this is to stop wizard spam)


Yep... that's the idea...

demyse wrote:Byzantii - Auxilia Bestiarius - Parma doesn't have a switch option, currently the profile is a whip in one hand, with the option of a sword or dagger in the other, but no indication what hand can use the parma


Well Switch is basically meant to ensure that certain weapons/armour can't be used together; generally speaking, look at Hands rather than me having to explain what hand can have what. Does that make sense?

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Jonathon Chester » Sat Jun 09, 2018 8:41 am

Rob Ice Shards is listed as a focus spell but has a range
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Brightblade » Sat Jun 09, 2018 10:00 am

Jonathon Chester wrote:Rob Ice Shards is listed as a focus spell but has a range


Already mentioned that further up the thread...
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Jonathon Chester » Sat Jun 09, 2018 10:34 am

Ah was something a club mate spotted but hadn’t had approval yet
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby demyse » Mon Jun 25, 2018 3:13 pm

Sellswords
Morag of Mann is a spellcaster and only has a temper of 14

Beowa can be a noble commander of a Jute (Wiht) host, but there are no wiht mainstay option
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Mon Jun 25, 2018 3:25 pm

demyse wrote:Sellswords
Morag of Mann is a spellcaster and only has a temper of 14


Ooops... yes, I'll fix that.

demyse wrote:Beowa can be a noble commander of a Jute (Wiht) host, but there are no wiht mainstay option


Good point. I must remember to think about the sell-swords being commanders in other hosts.

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Wed Jun 27, 2018 8:10 pm

Currently working on the musters for the latest updates.

Some interesting changes for you all include most two-weapon options getting the Quick Strike rule and the addition of Strength to the profiles.

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby James Balmer » Wed Jun 27, 2018 10:21 pm

Nice, that should make the two weapon options more enticing when compared to 2-handed weapons.
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Brightblade » Thu Jun 28, 2018 5:21 am

Rob Lane wrote:Currently working on the musters for the updates.


I've only just printed and laminated the last lot...

Can we possibly have set times when they are updated please, like maybe twice yearly or quarterly?
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Jonathon Chester » Thu Jun 28, 2018 6:02 am

Brightblade wrote:
Rob Lane wrote:Currently working on the musters for the updates.


I've only just printed and laminated the last lot...

Can we possibly have set times when they are updated please, like maybe twice yearly or quarterly?


Well the last lot was last quarter ;)

Rob may be working on them but doesn't mean they'll appear straight away, no doubt playtesting will need to happen to make sure these changes are not going to knock the game off balance.
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Thu Jun 28, 2018 7:18 am

Brightblade wrote:I've only just printed and laminated the last lot...

Can we possibly have set times when they are updated please, like maybe twice yearly or quarterly?


Apologies, but I have promised in the past they'll be done every quarter, and we're now at the end of the second quarter of the year... the first quarter's update was late you see, it was at the start of May. Sorry dude!

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Thu Jun 28, 2018 7:19 am

James Balmer wrote:Nice, that should make the two weapon options more enticing when compared to 2-handed weapons.


That's basically the idea, really...

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby James Balmer » Fri Jun 29, 2018 8:52 am

Rob Lane wrote:
James Balmer wrote:Nice, that should make the two weapon options more enticing when compared to 2-handed weapons.


That's basically the idea, really...

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Quick question...

If Quick Strike causes 8s and 9s to be treated as Swift Strikes and generate the additional damage dice... do they also cause damage effects such as fire or cold on 8s and 9s?
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:00 am

No, because effect damage occurs with vicious wounds. I am also adding in vicious wound rules to certain things though, please note ;o)

Another change will be the addition of impact strikes to stuff that runs in and chins you - Gabrax, Tarvax, Chimera horn butt, etc.! Remember that impact strikes are separate to normal strikes and wounds are taken off immediately, and subsequent parries use their new C+A...

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Jonathon Chester » Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:01 am

James Balmer wrote:
Rob Lane wrote:
James Balmer wrote:Nice, that should make the two weapon options more enticing when compared to 2-handed weapons.


That's basically the idea, really...

Cheers
Rob

Quick question...

If Quick Strike causes 8s and 9s to be treated as Swift Strikes and generate the additional damage dice... do they also cause damage effects such as fire or cold on 8s and 9s?


No, quick strike generates extra hits to be parried on 8 and 9's not extra damage so would not generate those types of effects.
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:04 am

Jinx!
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Jonathon Chester » Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:32 am

:lol:
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby James Balmer » Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:46 am

Jonathon Chester wrote:
James Balmer wrote:
Rob Lane wrote:
That's basically the idea, really...

Cheers
Rob

Quick question...

If Quick Strike causes 8s and 9s to be treated as Swift Strikes and generate the additional damage dice... do they also cause damage effects such as fire or cold on 8s and 9s?


No, quick strike generates extra hits to be parried on 8 and 9's not extra damage so would not generate those types of effects.


Ah, I must confess I did only lightly skim read the rule and I have slept since that time.
The effects are generated at the damage stage? So after the strikes have been generated and parried. Meaning they still occur on 9s only.
That sound about right?
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Rob Lane » Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:47 am

That's right James. You'll get vicious wounds (i.e., effect damage on 8 or 9) on some monsters with the next muster update ;o)

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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby Jonathon Chester » Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:52 am

Rob Lane wrote:That's right James. You'll get vicious wounds (i.e., effect damage on 8 or 9) on some monsters with the next muster update ;o)

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Rob


Will this incur a cost increase or is it a general desire to give monsters a little boost?
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby James Balmer » Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:05 am

Rob Lane wrote:That's right James. You'll get vicious wounds (i.e., effect damage on 8 or 9) on some monsters with the next muster update ;o)

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Rob

Oh gods I needs some of them monsters.
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Re: Kindred Musters Update IV - 3rd May 2018

Postby James Balmer » Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:08 am

While we're here and discussing effects, I can't for the life of me find anything in the current musters that uses corrosion damage... I don't suppose you could point me at something that does?

If not it's no worry, I was just reading through and came to the conclusion that corrosion is quite powerful, destroying a piece of equipment in addition to causing 1d10 damage and wanted to see what used it.

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